Flowing and Silent Forms Dart By

Frequently Asked Questions

Effect Rules

• Does "you can't destroy the same Invader twice in one action" also apply to Presence destruction?
  Yes — a single action can't destroy the same Presence more than once.

  This can happen with Flowing and Silent Forms Dart by in concert with anything that adds Blight one after another in multiple lands, like cascades or Volcano's Explosive Eruption.
  Tags: Destroy, Saved From Destruction, Blight, Presence, 4 more...

General Play

• Is there an ordering or priority for action modifications? It seems weird that you can get a benefit from something being destroyed even if you save it from destruction.
  Yes:

  • First change quantity (eg: Pour Time Sideways);
  • Then do any canceling or replacement (eg: Flowing and Silent Forms Dart By / A Year of Perfect Stillness);
  • Finally do any other sort of additional or altered effects (eg: threshold on Instruments of Their Own Ruin).

  The practical upshot of this is mostly "you can't both prevent something from happening and do extra stuff because it's happening" - eg, if Volcano Looming High's Presence would be destroyed, but it's saved somehow, you don't get to deal damage.

  If a modifier cancels just part of something, modifiers to that part don't apply. Eg: Entrap the Forces of Corruption doesn't stop Blight from being added, but it does stop it from cascading, so another modifier which changed how cascades worked wouldn't apply.

  As before, if you have multiple modifiers with no clear order, you get to pick which happens first. For instance: you play Infestation of Venomous Spiders with threshold on a land with Dahan about to Ravage. A Fear Card says "Invaders do not Ravage in lands with Dahan". When that Ravage would happen, there are two different "skip this Ravage" modifiers. You get to decide which one to do first, so can choose it to be the Venomous Spiders. This wouldn't be true if the entire Ravage Step got skipped, or if the Ravage Card were changed to match different lands - those happen before you ever reach the individual Ravage Action – but as of JE, the only Fear cards that work this way are Explorers Are Reluctant and Immigration Slows, levels 2 and 3.

  This is an addition to published rules – the intent is that it will be included in the rulebook of a future expansion.
  Tags: Action Modifiers, Skipping Actions, Pour Time Sideways (Fractured Days Split the Sky), Flowing and Silent Forms Dart By, 19 more...
• What's the timing of ongoing effects expiring?
  All "this turn" effects wear off at the same time. For now, assume all normal Time Passes activity (discard, lose elements, clear damage, ongoing effects expire) is simultaneous. Cards like Gift of Constancy (which modify discarding Powers) or Unquenchable Flames work because they explicitly specify a timing.

  Rules for non-standard things that happen during Time Passes (like Shroud of Silent Mist's Slow and Silent Death) can be done before or after effects wearing off unless otherwise specified.

  If it ever becomes clear that there really ought to be some sort of internal ordering to Time Passes, we'll call out that ordering in whatever expansion / FAQ it becomes relevant.
  Tags: Time Passes, Timing, Defend, Action Modifiers, 33 more...
• If an effect says that you may X to Y (e.g., paying Energy to gain a Power Card, Destroying Presence to skip an Event on a board), are you allowed to get the second half for free if you can't do the first half?
  No, the second half is gated behind paying the cost in the first half. Similarly, "you may Y by X" requires paying the cost in the second half to get the effect in the first half.

  While this tends to be pretty obvious when the cost is paying Energy, it's less clear if the cost is performing some other effect, like discarding a card or removing Presence.

  While you must be able to pay the cost in order to get the bonus, ongoing effects can alter the final result of the cost being paid. For example, you can successfully pay the cost of "Destroy 2 Presence" even if Flowing and Silent Forms Dart By will end up saving that Presence from destruction if you do so. On the other hand, you can't attempt to pay the cost with Presence under Absolute Stasis, since that Presence only exists for Victory/Defeat – it doesn't exist as far as the Event is concerned.
  Tags: Action Modifiers, Flowing and Silent Forms Dart By, Absolute Stasis (Fractured Days Split the Sky), Turmoil's Touch (Wandering Voice Keens Delirium), 11 more...

Spirits and Innate Powers

• As Volcano, when destroying your own Presence for Explosive Eruption, can that Presence be saved (by, e.g., Flowing and Silent Forms Dart By)?
  Yes, but not usefully. It doesn't count towards the eruption thresholds (because they check the # of Presence actually destroyed) or for Collapse In a Blast of Lava and Steam (because "destroy" gets replaced with "push" before the rule "when your Presence is destroyed, deal damage" kicks in).

  Prior to the ruling that cancellation/replacement always happens before changes/additions, you could decide on the ordering, and apply Collapse In a Blast of Lava and Steam's damage before Flowing and Silent Forms Dart By's substitution. but this is no longer true.
  Tags: Saved From Destruction, Action Modifiers, Presence, Destroy, 4 more...
• If Vengeance as a Burning Plague's presence is saved from destruction, does it still get to add a Disease?
  No. Both because of the phrasing "...where each Destroyed Presence was", which is meaningless if no Presence is actually destroyed; and because the replacement must be applied before other modifications.

  The phrasing on this is pretty unclear - "...where each Destroyed Presence was" is a check that should happen after Presence might be destroyed, not at the moment Presence might be destroyed. The rule would have been better done either as a triggered action ("After your Presence is destroyed..."), or phrased as "...instead Replace your Presence with a Disease".
  (Discussion elsewhere) (Discussion elsewhere)  Tags: Saved From Destruction, Vengeance as a Burning Plague, Flowing and Silent Forms Dart By
• If Finder of Paths Unseen makes 2 of its lands adjacent, then uses the Moon+Air threshold of its 1st innate to Push its Presence out of one of those lands, are those two lands still adjacent for the Sun+Air threshold?
  Yes. They're adjacent for the whole action (Power use), but then cease being adjacent once you're done resolving the Power because they're no longer both your lands.
  Tags: Actions, Open the Ways (Finder of Paths Unseen), Lay Paths They Cannot Help But Walk (Finder of Paths Unseen), Flowing and Silent Forms Dart By, 7 more...